Episode 251

Defending Your Culture with Mike Boyle

In this episode, Mike Boyle joins me to talk about his brand new book, Designing Strength Training Programs and Facilities 2nd Ed.

[00:00:00] Hello, my friends. Welcome to another episode of The Business Fee in Accordance podcast, and I am so stoked to welcome back to the podcast legend, a man who needs no introduction. So excited to have him back. Mr. Mike Boyle, welcome back to the podcast. So good to have you. Thank you for having me. I love, I’m a big listener, so I like to be, I like to be back on, I like to get in the repeat guest category.

Yeah. I’m so stoked that you’re one of the repeat guests. I’ll have you on every week if you’re got, if you got the time we have, there’s plenty for us to talk about. And today I’m so excited to dive in because you put out a second edition of your book Designing Strength Training Programs and Facilities.

It’s amazing. I started reading it already. I’m not all the way through yet, but I’ve, I’m halfway and it’s full of a ton of. Updated thoughts and perspectives from you, from your first time writing the book? I think it’s super topical. You put a lot of stuff in there that’s about the things that Jim owns are experiencing right now when thinking about training and programming and designing their facilities.

And there’s even some sections in there that I’ll probably ask you [00:01:00] about creating community and expectations on the training floor that I really love. And so thank you for willing me to come and talk about the book. How are you feeling about its reception so far? The reception has been really good.

I’m very happy we’ve gotten most of the Amazon reviews we’ve gotten, cuz the majority of the sales have been on Amazon. Yep. And the reviews have been almost entirely positive, which is always good. It’s amazing that even at this stage of the game, I. Still look at the reviews and see how many stars gave me and read their comments.

And of course we, we always will always be doing that. Yeah. Lemme, let’s start with this. So what inspired you to go back this material and update it? The big thing was having read through it and realize, wow, this is, I think with any book that you write, I would say any book you write is probably, Two or three years behind where you really are, because by the time you get there, you always have that feeling of, oh my God, I could go back and start over.

Yep. And then when you have one like this, that’s about, going [00:02:00] on almost 20, probably 18 years ago I wrote it. I probably wrote that one in 2005. And as a follow up after I wrote functional training for sports, I wanted to write one that I thought was a little more kind of nuts and boltsy a little bit more for strength coaches and trainers.

And then when I read it I thought, oh my God, there’s so much stuff in here that I don’t even agree with anymore. There’s so many things that I would say differently and I thought, I’m thinking this is my last kind of big project. And I said, all right, I wanna update this whole thing and get it out and have everything be really current.

The good thing. And you, we alluded to it in the conversation before you hit the record button, the way publishing is now. Yep. You are more up to date because. You can finish the manuscript and you can almost have it up within a couple weeks. Yep. Which in the past was never the case. So in that way it’s extremely current with.

What I’m thinking right now.[00:03:00] Yeah. Good for you. Good for you. Let’s start there. I remember, I remember that you have a forward by Dan John, which is awesome. And in there, one of the things that he says is, is having the knowledge is one thing. Having this knowledge is one thing as a trainer, but be able to really apply it to how you design your programs and how you create an experience for your clients is another.

So what are some of the ways where your opinion has changed? Since writing the book the first time, what are those, some of those new ideas that are in this book that weren’t in the first? I think a lot of ’em, from an athletic standpoint, I would say there’s a whole speed chapter that’s entirely different.

That probably doesn’t apply as much to the business for unicorns audience, but a lot of the stuff that I put in the beginning in terms of. I put a lot more autobiographical stuff in there, things about me, things about thought process, things about coaching. A lot of the first not the first.

The first part is just facility design, and even that’s updated initially. I say to people, don’t buy half racks. Now we have all half racks. There were things that we talked about in [00:04:00] terms of. How you’re gonna design your facility, the percentage of open space. I think that’s a big thing that’s changed over the years.

We just keep going to more open space. I was talking to a guy the other day on Instagram about a place in Europe. He was like, what do you think? And I said, I think less equipment, more space. That’s what I’m always thinking. Resist the urge to buy. Yeah. Stuff that you like. And they have lots of, anybody who’s got a facility with lots of one-off pieces of equipment knows I can’t really run groups, I can’t run a business.

And I think. We’ve always approached it because I think doing a good job, training teams in the collegiate environment translates really well to doing a good job training, the small, whatever we wanna call it, small group personal training, however you look at that, but the ability to say, okay, how do I get X number of people through X amount of space?

In X amount of time really is fundamentally what it comes down to is how do I make money at this? And you don’t make money. As a hobbyist who has [00:05:00] buys equipment that he likes or buys equipment that he wore he or she wants to use. Yep. You make money by being able to get a group of people a really good quality workout in the space constraints that you’re given based on your budget or your square footage or whatever that actually is.

So that’s. I feel like it’s a really good nuts and bolts book that way. Yeah. I think it’s such a great insight, Mike, cuz I’ve seen that myself having, really only been in the industry for just over a decade. I’ve seen myself that switch from people having gyms full of equipment to more and more open space.

And I see people’s reactions when they come to a place like Mark Fisher Fitness. I. To how little equipment we have. We have so few toys, and I know we’re unique and we’re in New York, so we have to make use of every square inch. But I think it’s a great mantra for any gym in any market is how many bodies you can fit in the space.

Working out at a given primetime hour is the directly correlated to how much money you can make, right? If you want to [00:06:00] get people throw flow through the space, you need space for bodies to move. If you pack it all in with equipment, you’re just shooting yourself in the foot. Yeah, exactly.

And I think we’ve all gone, and that’s why I talked about that in the first part of the book. I said, the old weight rooms, I called ’em Noah’s Arc weight rooms. Yeah. We just bought two of everything. Yep. You had two benches and two incline benches and two, places to do overhead press and you had two leg presses and it was just two of everything.

I’m just gonna get two of everything and that’s gonna be our gym. And then as people started to look at this more the kind of the micro gym business that is, Mark Fish Fitness or is Mike Boyle strength and conditioning of those kind of places, you start looking at that and thinking they’re not for somebody who’s buying a membership and is just gonna come in and putter around and wander from machine to machine, they’re a place, whether you call it groups or classes, or whether you call it small group personal training, what, whatever you call it.

Most of us are trying to group people together Yep. And [00:07:00] move them through the facility. In some sort of orderly fashion, and as you said, having the right equipment, knowing, seeing the decisions that somebody’s making after now at my stage, 40 years of mistakes. There are times where you think, oh, wow, that, that seemed like a good idea, eh?

Yep. Wasn’t such a good idea. We went back to this. Yeah. Instead, is there any equipment these days that you used to think was just absolutely essential that you don’t think is essential anymore? Not as much because we’ve really just been the kind of place that had we, we’ve always had to have some kind of pulley system.

We’ve had Kaiser stuff for literally decades because I like the air based pulley. I think it’s really conducive to both the athlete and the. Older client because you can go up by a pound. And you can do it fast. There’s no whip in the weight stack. But if you came in, much like you said with Mark Fisher Fitness, if you came into our facility, the [00:08:00] person who had not been there before would look and think, wow, there’s not much variety here.

There’s a whole bunch of racks, there’s a whole bunch of bars, there’s a whole bunch of plates, there’s a whole bunch of dumbbells, there’s a whole bunch of kettlebells. There’s really only six or seven central items Yep. That are in that gym. But we use those items and we buy those items for their ability to be multi-use.

We look at this and think, I know that I can do a lot with a kettlebell. I know I can do a lot with a dumbbell. I know I can do a lot with my Kaiser pulley machines. And so I’m gonna have a lot of those. We’ve got adjustable benches. We’ve probably got 16 adjustable benches and Yep. God knows how many dumbbells, but that allows us to get a lot of stuff done.

Yeah, 100%. I’m a big cook and I, I bought a house two years ago and I’ve been filling my hou my kitchen with all these things I love to cook with. And one of the rules my husband and I came up with when we first moved, bought into this house is we can only buy things for the kitchen that have multi-use.

We [00:09:00] can’t buy any single use appliances, any single use gadgets. And it makes a big difference. It’s no, I don’t need that that cherry pit pitter that I use for only one thing once every other year. Things as you clog up your kitchen space. Yeah, exactly. And you’ve gotta move things around.

And it’s, it’s funny because I’m reading, not that this isn’t gonna do it in my book, I shouldn’t be pumping anybody else’s book, but I’m reading. Unreasonable hospitality right now, which is good one. It’s a restaurant book. Yep. But it’s an amazing book because you realize there’s so much parallel.

Yep. Between cooking and the restaurant business and the fitness business. 100%. I think they’re probably the two that I think go the closest together because you have a product that has to be really good. And then you have to serve that product effectively to a a consumer who’s going to be pretty discerning.

And they’re gonna know the difference between bad and good. And if you looked at that, I could be describing the. Mike Oil strength conditioning or Mark Fish fitness [00:10:00] or a good restaurant Yep. In Boston, New York. Yep. And conceptually it’s really similar. Yeah. I would say I, I couldn’t agree more.

I think it’s part of the reason why I felt so comfortable up first in fitness because. Cause my background was in hospitality. Even though I’ve never been a trainer a day in my life, I’ve always felt like I know this space. I know creating this kind of service and be part in part because they’re so similar.

And I think, a lot of gym owners should read more books about hospitality, including Absolutely. That one. It’s funny, I have where am I siting the table I have sitting right here, which I’m gonna read next after Unreasonable Hospitality. And yeah, I, hundred percent my wife and I were in the.

Restaurant business for years when we were younger. Bart and waitress and did that stuff. But you’re right, it is ultimately a hospitality business. Very similar. Yeah. To restaurant making, making people feel welcome, like you were expecting them. Creating an environment where they are comfortable enough to try new things.

It’s, there’s so much overlap. Actually that’s a, and. And yet Good. You have to have a really good product. Yeah, [00:11:00] 100%. You gotta have enough product to keep them wanting to come back. They have to want to come back and back and look forward to your product and look forward to the experience they have with the people serving that product.

The relationships they build with the bartenders and the servers and the trainers. That’s key. It’s so key. Which actually is a good transition. I think somewhere, I think it’s your first chapter. You talk a little bit about rules on the training floor. I think you give something like seven rules on the training floor.

And I just would love to, wouldn’t have to go through all of them, but I would love just hear your thoughts about how creating kind of rules for people working on the training floor is part of how you create this environment. It’s part of what the service winds up becoming in your space. Are the expectations you set for everyone in that space.

So can you maybe talk through a little bit about what’s, why is it so important to have like rules of conduct for people in the gym? I I think it’s particularly important to have rules of conduct for people in the gym because people in the gym tend to be incredibly rude and self-centered.

Yeah. So by [00:12:00] having rules and saying, Hey, here is the way that I want you to conduct yourself when you’re in this facility, I think you create a level of expectation for people and say, okay, here, one of the simple ones we always talk about, no. I say EarPods and my daughter was like, they’re AirPods dad.

And I’m like, you think stick in your ear and generic your EarPods, but we don’t allow people to jam to their own ear. And peop some people think, oh that’s terrible. And I think, no, it’s not because one, we can’t coach you. Yep. If you have EarPods in. Two, we can’t account for your safety if you have EarPods in, because if I yell to you, Hey Michael, I just dropped this huge dumbbell, and it’s rolling towards your foot.

Yep. And you’re jammed away to whatever your personal taste was, that’s in your head and your foot gets crushed and you’re mad at me. And it’s antisocial because you’re not going to talk to people in your group if you have your headphones on or your EarPods in, or your beats on or whatever it is.[00:13:00]

We just thought, I think a lot of about common sense things. About how we would like people to conduct themselves in the facility. Yeah, I think all of that makes, it makes so much sense and I think our listeners are probably gonna be listening to along that and nodding their head and be like, yes, we should do something similar.

Cuz it also contributes to the flow of people through your space. That, if people are wearing headphones and not paying attention to each other, excuse me, or not being generous in sharing equipment or whatever rules you put in place that help. Actually the interaction, they help the flow of people through the space, I think is so critical.

I think people are afraid to set rules and guidelines sometimes cuz they wanna do whatever the client wants, but that’s actually not what’s best for everyone. No. That idea of appeasing I want, I what’s best for the clients ultimately, but, One level above that is I do want what’s best for the business.

Yeah. Yeah. And I always, from the hospitality I always say the customer’s always right, up until the moment that they’re wrong. Exactly. There’s gonna be, and that’s [00:14:00] in unreasonable hospitality. Yes. He says the exact same thing. Yes. In terms of, there’re gotta be points where you say, no, that, that’s not going to work.

And that’s kinda a, that’s a jumping off point for us in terms of if it has to be that way for you, then yes, you have to be someplace else. Yep. Because you need, if you don’t have rules and you don’t have standards, then you just have this sort of anarchy. You’ve got people just doing whatever they want and that’s when people start.

Throwing weights and not putting weights away. All of the basic kind of gym etiquette things that you would hope that everybody in every fitness facility would be adhering to. But when you extend that slightly further in terms of. Even dress, how, what people are gonna wear. There’s just a lot of stuff that, because you have to think about, I think of everything, I’m a big bell curve guy.

But you have to think of everything as the bell curve and realize that there’s probably 10% of the people on either end of the curve that you’re not [00:15:00] going to please and they’re probably not your people. Yep. But you’ve gotta look at the 60 that’s in the middle of that curve. Those are your people.

And so if I’ve got somebody that’s way out here on that, on the right hand side that just is really offensive, behaviorally then I can’t have them in my facility because Yep. They’re gonna eventually drive some of my 60% away. Yeah. So you have to, and again, our rules, it’s not incredibly restrictive.

It’s not anything of course stupid. Yeah. It’s just, I think a lot of the basic. Common decency, I think. Yeah. I think it’s a core function of our job as business owners and leaders, right? Is to put rules in place, put policies in place, put systems in place that tend to the greater good, right?

If our job is to be, the. The kind of chief gardener of this culture that we’re creating right then. We have to make sure that we pull the weeds once in a while. They’re really clear on what goes in the garden [00:16:00] and what doesn’t, if we wanna continue to make it thrive. And I think, people are afraid to have those.

Boundaries sometimes cuz it requires some difficult conversations. But, we both know, I’m sure there’s gonna be people who are just at the either end of that bell curve who are not a good fit and they gotta go. They, we can help them find somewhere else where they’ll be a better fit, but they will take that 60% in the middle and make them miserable.

Or they’ll shift. I find that people will shift a lot if you initiate a discussion, not necessarily a confrontation, but just a discussion in terms of, Hey this is not gonna work for us. The vast majority of people will shift their behavior. They won’t. Go line in the sand in terms of Okay, screw you.

Yeah. We had one client, for instance, he wanted to be barefoot all the time. And I had other clients who were really grossed out. Now it’s really strange. In our facility, soft feet are not considered offensive. Bare feet are, don’t really understand that particularly. I just know if I have a hundred kids walking around in socks, I don’t get one complaint.

Yep. If I have one guy walking around in [00:17:00] bare feet, I’ll get a series of complaints. So our thing was, Regardless of how you feel about, barefoot training, whatever it is, you need to have socks on minimally. That’s the bare minimum we can accept. You cannot be barefoot. And we had one of our clients and I had to have a couple of conversations with ’em over a couple of times.

But eventually he came around and he realized, okay, Mike’s gonna keep talking about this with me. He’s not gonna ignore the fact that I’m ignoring him and I’m thumbing my nose at him. It’s no, that, yeah, it doesn’t work and it doesn’t work. Not because I’m offended. It doesn’t work because I have clients who are offended. And I would’ve to look at it if it was just me. If someone said, oh, Mike’s got a weird thing about Toes, he doesn’t like to see him. I’d have to probably live with that. Yep. But when I have a series of clients who are, it’s funny people, I don’t like to lay on the turf.

Where he was walking with his bare feet, and I’m what? But you don’t mind where he walks with his socks. That’s so strange. And I don’t say that. I just Yeah, of course. Of course. But what you know, that is exactly. [00:18:00] I think it’s a great takeaway for our listeners. And actually you just demonstrated something in that book setting the Table by Danny Meyer.

He talks about this concept that you just illustrated so well, which is the idea that part of how we manage our community, how we manage people, is we provide constant, gentle pressure. Then you did that with that conversation, which is, I’m gonna go back and just keep talking to ’em about it and over time they’re gonna realize, Mike’s just gonna keep talking to me about this until I change it.

And it’s that constant gentle pressure that you’re right. We’ll then change people’s minds and have them act a little differently. And and I think so many of our listeners could stand to have a little bit more constant. Gentle pressure instead of what we often do, which Understandable. Which is avoid the difficult conversation.

You gotta keep leading in. I think you have a feeling about culture. Yeah. And how you want your culture to be. And then you have to, as you said, maybe gently be, maybe repeatedly defend your culture now. This is the culture, this is how the place is gonna run. Yep. And we’d love to have you [00:19:00] here, but we also realize that.

Yeah. If somebody’s gonna be expendable here, it will be you. Not us. We’re not going anywhere. I know there’s there’s so many other parts of the book that we haven’t got talked about yet, so I wanna just spend maybe a few minutes if you have the time, talk a little bit about the programming part of this.

So what ideas are in this book about your approach to programming these days that people can look forward to finding? The biggest difference is the core training chapter. It’s crazy in terms of, I’ve written. I wrote functional training for sports, and then I rewrote that in 2016 as new functional training for sports.

Two entirely different core training chapters. I wrote designing strength training programs and facilities in 2005, right after functional training for sports. That core training chapter was different, and then I went one step further in this one, and this one is again different. So I think from the programming standpoint, that would probably be the biggest change.

And we’re still not there, honestly. I think we’re still talking about. Breathing [00:20:00] and how we control our abdominals and how whether we, how we rotate. Where we rotate. When we rotate. But that’s, I would say, if I’m looking at the programming part, that’s the biggest difference in programming.

There’s probably some subtle differences in terms of, if we’re looking at kind of knee dominant, hip dominant stuff, there’s probably very little difference in terms of, I feel like pushing and pulling. Don’t change appreciably. And those sections are probably reasonably short. There’s a really long section on sled training because I think that’s something that, it was interesting I was listening to.

Do you ever listen to Peter Tia to the Drive podcast? I know I know it. I don’t listen to it regularly, but Sorry. But you should one, I just put up thing, listen to his most recent one about, he calls it the centenarian Decathlon. So he talks about the things that you want to be able to do in the last 10 years of your life.

Wow. Yeah. And how you should be training. It’s a, he’s got a, it’s philosophically, it’s very interesting. Anyway, he also just wrote a new book called Outlive. I shouldn’t be pumping, I’m pumping other people’s books on this. I’m not gonna, I’m not [00:21:00] gonna sell very many books for me, but I might sell something some other.

But and one of the things he talks about is the ability, I think to push a sled a hundred steps that has your body weight on it. Because he talks about things that. As a, like you’re old and suddenly you realize, wait a second, I’ve gotta drag my significant other Yes. To safety at some point, or from one room to another, or to get to an ambulance or whatever it is.

He said, there are gonna be these sort of life skills on and off the toilet, up and down the stairs, up from the floor. And so much of this stuff we would look at as functional training, right? You would say, oh, that’s. That falls in that realm of functional training that we are programming, but yet so much of it are the things that you also want to be able to do.

Yeah, late in life, which is why when I look at this book, even though it probably initially was written for athletes and coaches, when I look at it now, I think [00:22:00] it’s really written for everybody because getting people, this is why I love Attia stuff. He said probably the number one thing you can do if you wanna live a better, longer life.

Is to get stronger. Yeah, for sure. And you’ve been through it at, I’m sure, at at your place, but Yep. It’s amazing to watch people who can’t get up and down off the grounding. Yeah. And that’s a really telling thing when you look at someone and realize, wow, they’ve got, he said one of the things basically, I called it an elder getup and one of my friends got mad at me.

She said, can’t use an elder, but, and the elder getup you, you should be able to get up off the ground. With only one touch. Sure. And you realize that’s hard. Split stance, lunch, dance, unilateral stance, balance, all of these things core. But your ability to navigate late in life.

Is really going to come down to you. People don’t like the word functional anymore. I don’t know what the right word is if it’s not functional, but [00:23:00] yeah, it’s that ability to be functionally strong Yeah. Makes a difference. Yeah. Maybe, I dunno if a better word or not, but something just practically strong, right?

Just to be able to practically do what you wanna do in your life. And I’m hearing so many more people in like our unicorn study members, when they talk about the new clients that are coming in to their gyms and the goals that their general population clients have. More and more people are talking about they’re working out now to be stronger and better later in life.

That they, there is a lot of that energy in the general population. People see the connection now more than they did forever years ago. I think that’s, sorry to interrupt. Yeah. I think that’s the biggest growth area for us. Yeah. In the adult fitness market is realizing that. Because and I was listening to this, a TIA podcast today in my drive in, but.

His thing is that if you can still breathe and move, there’s no point of no return. But I look at some people sometimes and think, wow, you can get really close [00:24:00] to a point of no return, where you look and think, wow, this person has let themselves go so far. Yeah. That they can’t. They can barely get up and down out of a chair with two legs.

There’s no chance that anything in split stands is gonna be able to be done in terms of, getting up off the floor without help or Sure. Having to, like he was talking about, one of the tasks was being able to lift 30 pounds over your head so you could pick up a kid, Uhhuh.

And there is so many of these life skills things that we’re gonna deal with maybe as grandparents at some point in our life where you think, wow, and this will make you laugh at my son, I got the most left-handed compliment the other day in terms of he said, dad, He goes, you’re living proof that if you just do a little bit of stuff, but you do it really consistently for a long time.

He goes, you move pretty good for a 60 something year old guy. He said, you don’t really do that much. I was like, that’s great I think he’s. That’s it though. So more and more people are recognizing I, I think I even said this when I went to a new trainer recently where I live up in the woods now, [00:25:00] and my, when they’re asking me about my goals, I said, honestly, I’m just working out now so I can get up and out off the toilet when I’m 60, 70, 80.

I, I wanna. Work out now just at the groundwork for me, being strong enough to live through older age and the reaction I got from my trainer who’s an amazing trainer was like, oh I don’t hear that often, but I am hearing that kind of sentiment more and more from general population folks going to gyms.

They’re recognizing that I don’t need a six pack. I don’t need to sprint fast. I’m not trying to play sports. I’m not even trying to lose weight. I don’t actually care about that. I’m just trying to move so that I don’t have to have a million surgeries and have I, I can have a good quality of life as I age, and I think it’s a great lens.

I think our industry should embrace more. Yes, and I think that’s why, and it’s interesting, it’s this, it’s the modification and that’s what I think a lot of the book is about. It’s the modification of the idea. Of training like an athlete, you sh you wanna train like an athlete. [00:26:00] Yeah. You, but you wanna look at what’s the game.

Yep. And the game, like for you or me, the game is now life. And life is about can I take a walk when I want to? Can I get up and down off the toilet? Can I get up and down stairs? Can I get, can I pick up kids off the ground? These are all the things that you realize at some point you wake up and think, shit, I can’t do this stuff anymore.

Yep. Yeah, I love that analogy the training might look a very similar, but what’s the game that people are playing? And in many cases it’s a game of parenting. It’s a game of grandparenting, it’s a game of grocery shopping, living life. That’s a great way of thinking about it.

Yeah. That’s what is interesting in that he, like I said, this centenarian decathlon, he said he wants to be able to walk, three miles in 60 minutes. So he wants, which again, not a quick pace, but he’d be able, wants to be able to walk for an hour. He wants to be able to carry 50% of his body weight for.

A minute. He want they all, and he’s got all, he’s actually done a good job cuz he’s pulled a lot of this stuff together. Yeah. And it’s really interesting. Also I think it’s also just a great [00:27:00] Yeah, for sure. It’s a great just market opportunity with the, baby boomer generation being, huge aging population in this country that are not gonna have access to a ton of amazing social network resources in the these days that they’re gonna need.

They’re gonna be turning to local health and wellness professionals. Gyms to find out how to live a great life at, in an older age. And I think this is a great opportunity. I’m seeing more and more gym owners in unicorn society come in serving populations over 50, over 60. I think it’s a great both business opportunity and way to contribute to, our aging fellow Americans.

If you look at the data being stronger and being more cardiovascularly fit Yeah. Contribute greatly. To your longevity. It’s not saying you’re not gonna get cancer, it’s not saying that something else isn’t gonna happen, but statistically speaking, people, and then you just get into the idea of stronger, again, we go back to the functional word, right?

Functionally strong. It’s not necessarily, can you bench press [00:28:00] 300 pounds, but it’s, can you do 10 pushups? Can you hold a plank? Can you do body weight squats? Can you do step-ups? Can you do lunges? Those are the kind of things. And that’s where I think the educated trainer our market, I would say.

Thinking that you and us are a lot of times approaching a really similar market. We’re approaching intelligent consumer most, cuz again, for us, our adult businesses booming. Yep. They’re intelligent, they have disposable income. And as you said, they’re looking at quality of life issues now.

Yeah. Much more than they ever had. And they’re realizing that what they’re doing, Suddenly the mobility and the foam rolling and the stretching and all this stuff, it all matters. Yeah. It’s not just lift weights. It’s not just sweat. It’s not just ride a bike. There’s so many, there’s pieces to this whole kind of mosaic that are all essential.

And you need to have all of the pieces. You can’t. And when I talk about just in [00:29:00] normal training, I always talk about the idea that it’s it’s a recipe, not a menu. That goes back to your sort of cooking analogy, right? Yeah. It’s not a menu. You don’t get to pick. You can’t come in and just say, oh, I want one of these and one of these, and one of these.

It’s the, a process of. That’s, what, going back to the book idea, the book is really about updating the recipe. Okay. We’ve made some changes to the recipe and the recipe, the product is still, the end product that you’re getting out is still roughly similar, but how we’re gonna go about creating that end product has changed.

And in this book particularly, you get the thought process behind it. What was he, what was I thinking? When I was making these changes, what caused me to make these changes? Yeah. And so there’s, I think it’ll be, I think it’s an interesting read. I haven’t had anybody read it and not like it yet.

I think it’s a great summary. Let’s wrap it up there, Mike, that was amazing. Dear listeners, if you want the updated recipe for how Mike Boyle is creating results for his clients, you gotta get the damn book. Where can they get the book, Mike? Amazon the [00:30:00] easiest place. I know if you’re not an Amazon person, you can go to on Target.

I know there are some people who are Yeah. In Thes world, but I love simplicity, unfortunately, and I love, well-run companies, so I’m not an Antiaz Amazon person, but Yep. On target, if you go to On Target, I think it’s on target publications.com. Okay. But if you just type in on Target, Mike Boyle, we’ll find it, leave it in the notes down below, along with an Amazon link for you pro Amazon folks.

But yeah, I’ll go get this. Book, if you are just starting a gym or you have opened, have a gym for many years, or if you’re just a personal trainer I think, you can’t do better than following Mike’s advice on building a facility, building a culture, and creating programming that really gets your clients great results.

So thank you for sharing your wisdom, my friend. I’m so excited to finish reading it myself. I’m sure I’ll have you back again when I have more questions. But this was a real blast. So thank you so much for for taking the time to talk today. Thank you for taking the time to have me on. I appreciate it cuz I know this is a promotional appearance so I appreciate you guys.

You’ll be back again. I’m soon. I’m sure soon. So thank you. Thank you. And enjoy your day. You [00:31:00] too.